Suggestions needed

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

So a lot of people are locking their journals this week because LJ has started purging journals where incest is listed as an interest. I understand the concern that the purge may be more widespread than that, that this extremist group may have convinced LJ to go after journals where the word is simply mentioned in a post or something. But it does leave me with a dilemma. Nominations are supposed to start on June 1 but if my personal friends list is any indication, a lot of stories just became ineligible because the journals are now locked. Many people may archive their stories outside of LJ and that will help, but I'm not sure whether I should wait until mid-June or July to start nominations, since a lot of folks have said they are locking only temporarily. Any ideas or recommendations on how I should proceed? I'd hate for this awards program to die before it even got off the ground, but if the eligibility list gets cut in half it defeats the purpose of celebrating the rich variety of pairings in the LOTR fandom.

Thank you for your time and your collective brain power.

Candice

ETA: Well, I just read LJ's response in the Cnet article (http://news.com.com/Mass+deletion+sparks+LiveJournal+revolt/2100-1025_3-6187619.html) and I don't have a lot of faith that Six Apart understands how ridiculous their position is. So, I will be coming up with a solution to locked fics soon since all of you may have to keep your journals locked up for a while. They really seem to think they're going after pedophiles despite how irrational their logic.

Comments

[mesnica.livejournal.com]

Wait until mid-June. This probably should blow over very quickly, and two weeks more should give people the time they need to either archive their stories off LJ, or make their journals public again.

And I've not up to date on the wank (got it last night though), so what's the current stand of things? I thought they were going after easily searchable journals with certain keywords in the interests, no matter the actual content of these journals...

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

I thought they were looking only in interests too, but so many people are locking their journals who never had 'incest' anywhere on their profile so I'm not really sure what's going on. I do prefer only waiting a couple of weeks. I tend to miss big controversies until they're long gone, so I'm going to have pay attention over the next week and see how things begin to play out. Thanks for your input; I really appreciate it.

[luthien-af.livejournal.com]

I agree with mesnica. Wait a few weeks and then it'll probably clear again. And maybe an idea if it doesn't calm: what about posting the fics in this community and use one entry to link them... Only problem might be that you'll need the writers to agree.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

That's an interesting idea, and not just because of this latest issue. It could mean extending nominations to all fics if the authors agreed to have the stories temporarily archived publicly. I'll have to think about the logistics, but it's a great suggestion. Thank you.

[doylebaby.livejournal.com]

That was my advice going to be too. Just wait a couple of weeks until most of it has died down and people know where they stand.
I'm still preparing a nominations post, just have to start checking the links I have.

Btw, is it supposed to be only lj archived stories, or can they be archived somewhere else as well?

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

The stories can be archived anywhere, just as long as they're publicly available. Thanks for your input. I was concerned about the issue in general (free speech, censorship, etc.) but it was really stressing me out because of this comm.

[koulagirl666.livejournal.com]

See what happens and if LJ still haven't told us what their policy for permanent suspension is by June 1 post a note saying that you'll give everyone two weeks to work out what they're doing.

I do like luthien_af's suggestion of having the fics posted in the comm - perhaps once you've collected and sorted nominations, you could ask the authors' permission to post them in the comm with the polls or maybe a couple of days before.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

That's a good suggestion; thank you for your help. And I'm intrigued with luthien_af's idea. It could mean opening nominations up more broadly, and not just because of this current issue. I'll have to think about how the logistics but I like the concept.

[wynterhawk.livejournal.com]

I would wait a while as well. Maybe a little longer than June, for you never know what's lurking about. I don't think it would hurt to wait out the month of June and have everything ready to go by July 1st.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Thanks so much for your input. I guess the only reason why a month worries me is me. I have good momentum right now and I don't want to lose it. But if this doesn't blow over quickly I want to give people enough time to move their stories if they're so inclined so I'm thinking I might initially say June 15 and then pay close attention to what's going on.

[precious-rosie.livejournal.com]

I think waiting until all this has blown over might be a prudent move. I like the idea perhaps leaving it another month.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I think waiting will be the best thing to do. I just have to settle on how long. I thought of a lot of problems when I decided to start this but having LJ purging journals never even entered my mind! :-)

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

for one week or a set of amount of days deteremind by you that people should unlock their journals
Or just the stories that have been nominated. There are definitely a few solutions to getting around locked fics, and it may open up nominations to those stories that were locked before.

Thank you for having so much faith in me and this awards program. I'm getting more concerned about how LJ has responded to this, especially after reading the little they've said so far. But I'm not going to let the awards die because of it. I'll definitely come up with something everybody can live with.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Isn't it completely distressing. I still can't believe that they said the deletions weren't made on strictly legal grounds but because of the type of community they wanted to have on LJ. That just raises all kinds of alarm bells.

[tati.livejournal.com]

reading through the comments i have to agree with people. first, wait and see how everything goes concerning the drama. it may be over in a week if LJ people pull their heads out of their asses and stop this silliness. second, i love the idea of posting eligible fics in the comm - thus via tagging it will be so much easier to find the stories to nominate, and all in one place. i mean, for example, i read very few pairings, so i won't even touch any tag that has, say, Astin in it :P it doesn't even have to be this comm to keep it clean for the awards, but setting up a separate comm for this very purpose is not a hardship. i personally wanted to unlock eligible fics (hopes, hopes *wry smile*), but considering my own recent problem with an underage this option is out of question for me anymore, so i'd love to have a place where i could dump the fics temporarily. hell, i'm even prepared to finish Cheetahs... though, is its subject anywhere near acceptable for nomination anyway? LOL :)))

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Thanks so much for your feedback. I'm feeling less panicky now. When I first started seeing everything explode my first reaction was "WTF, how can LJ just delete people's journals without looking at the content" and my second reaction was "shit, there goes the awards comm." I'm still in shock about the purging but I'm much more sanguine about the awards. I really do like the idea of setting up a journal (somewhere else, maybe greatest journal, since I really don't want to give LJ any more business right now) to post all nominated fics if the authors agree. It could make me completely insane, but it really intrigues me.

[tati.livejournal.com]

GJ is a good idea, yeah. we all have accounts there, i'm sure

[kitty-trio.livejournal.com]

Ok, after reading the comments/suggestions above, here are my suggestions:

Delay for a couple weeks or a month to see if the furore dies down. I really doubt you’ll lose momentum, the fandom is aware of what’s going on and a short ‘breather’ while we see how the mess plays out is better in the long run.

As for f-locked entries/journals, most of us should have an idea of what authors/fics we intended to nominate, so can compile lists for when you are ready to accept them. If certain entries or journals we wanted to review before nominating are now locked, we should all be adult enough to:
1. Ask the author to add us (temporarily perhaps) to their f-list.
2. Accept requests to be added (again temporarily if need be) as they are intended: a fellow fandom member wanting to read/rec good fanfic.

If this mess is still making the authors remain locked when you are ready for us to begin reading/voting, one good option is to have the authors post the nominated fics here. Perhaps f-locked to members if the authors are still wary (with notice to the comm. ‘watchers’ to join so they can read)? If you end up hosting the nominated fics, might I suggest you work out a schedule for who posts what, when. It doesn’t have to be elaborate, just groupings to be posted each day over a week or however long. The groupings can be a mix of fic lengths, pairings, etc to give us a variety each day. (and yes, I am a ‘database queen’ and am offering to help you schedule so your time is more valuably used giving the authors plenty of advance warning about when to post in case availability constraints—can’t have that special fic everyone would love not being posted because the author was off on holiday *g*).

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Posting in "shifts" is an interesting idea; definitely something to mull over. It's true that people can request to be added to someone's friends list if a story is nominated that is locked, but it's also a potential barrier that I worry some people won't jump over but will instead skip the story. I have some things to think about and another week or so to work it all out. I really appreciate your input and may get in touch with you if the need arises to "host" stories here or on some other journal temporarily.

[angiepen.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this is late -- I've been surfing through the deletion stuff and am behind on the Flist. :/

The 6A CEO has posted his explanation/apology, though, and the additions to the explanation/apology. It's not much of an apology but it's more than I'd have expected and it came from the top guy of the company that owns LJ when he could've passed it off to a minion, so he gets some props for that.

It sounds like most and maybe [crossed fingers] all of the fannish journals should be reinstated over the next week or so. And in any case, Flocking wouldn't have helped -- they were going by interests lists, not reading the journals themselves. I hope that people who've Flocked in response to the journal suspension thing will come back out of their shells soon. [more crossed fingers]

Maybe delaying for a week or two, or even a month, would do it? At any rate, I think a wait-and-see for a while would be a good idea. Give it a while and see how things go before deciding anything. I think it's too early to make any binding decisions right now.

Angie

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

Thanks for your feedback, Angie. You're right, delaying the start and waiting to see what happens is the best bet. The timing of all this really sucks but it shouldn't be devastating.

Flocking wouldn't have helped -- they were going by interests lists, not reading the journals themselves
That's the impression I had so I was surprised that the reaction was to lock journals versus clearing out interest lists. I didn't think locked posts would have helped the people who were purged because it seemed clear that no one was actually taking the time to see if the allegations were actually warranted or not.

[angiepen.livejournal.com]

it seemed clear that no one was actually taking the time to see if the allegations were actually warranted or not.

Exactly. [nod] When they were deleting survivor communities for fuck's sake, to say nothing of the literary discussion about Nabokov, the Japanese fashion discussions and the RPG characters clearly marked as villians, it should be clear to anyone that they were not reading the journals themselves. [sigh]

A lot of folks just sort of automatically go into lockdown whenever there's a threat going around, whether it's logical or not. It's like ducking your head in an avalanche -- doesn't help at all but it's a reflex. Some people have that doesn't-help-at-all reflex regarding their journals. [wry smile]

Angie

[angiepen.livejournal.com]

Dammit, I do know how to spell "villain." [facepalm]

Angie, who just hauled out of bed and doesn't have a full set of neurons firing yet :P

[http://users.livejournal.com/saura_/]

There's a free archive that I've used some times (Mirrormere (http://avia.silverbloom.net/mirror/index.php)) that's free and uncensored.

Those who want to participate can post their fiction unlocked there?

Just an idea.

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

That's a good idea; thank you. :-) Maybe if I compile a list of all the archives that are available it can help people find a place to post stories if they want to keep their journals locked.

[silvan-lady.livejournal.com]

Since time has now passed and hopefully people will be unlocking anything that was locked, my tuppenceworth here may be irrelevant, especially since it all happened while I was on holiday, but I just thought I'd mention that as much as I'd like to take part and support the comm I don't have time to repost all my fics that are eligible for nomination in another location, and I suspect that would apply to other writers who have full-time jobs and families as well. I fully accept that that would be my choice of course, but I think you might find that other authors would be in the same position which would be a great shame after all the hard work you've put into this.

Possibly only people with locked journals would chose to post at the central location and I suspect that many people would go and read there, but would be less inclined to actually venture out into LJ land and search out the other eligible fics.

Of course, if it only means posting fics that are actually nominated, it would be a much lesser task, although reposting twenty or thirty chapters of something would still be time-consuming and would take up several posts since LJ limit posts to 10,000 words I believe.

Good luck with it - whatever you decide! *hugs* Hope you don't mind my random thoughts...

[foxrafer.livejournal.com]

I never mind hearing what people have to say, so no worries there. I was only ever concerned about locked posts. If a story is already unlocked anyone can read it so it's fine. I was just worried that all of a sudden there will be a bunch of locked stories that once were eligible but now weren't.

If someone is willing to temporarily unlock the story in their journal or if it's already archived somewhere else, that's perfect. The idea of having fics posted somewhere else even temporarily is really only for those people with locked journals and unarchived stories. But the choice will be completely up to the author so it is possible that with so many journals now being locked the pool of stories has shrunk but I've accepted that fact. It may mean that this fails or at least won't be as successful as I'd hoped, but hopefully I'll be able to give out at least a few awards.